To be clear..... many of the same neocons and right wingers who were hoping for a Ahmedinijad victory, and then saying the protests didn't matter, are now bleating hat they stand with the millions of people in the streets. Their brazen hypocrisy is stunning. But as repellent as they are, we can't just say "the enemy of my enemy is my friend." The election was a sham - as Juan Cole has made perfectly clear.

This isn't at all about being pro-Mousevi. It's about standing with the deepening of the protest movement and hoping that it beings the Iranian left - not to mention gays and national minorities - out of the closets and into the streets.

All the best
Dave Zirin

Where are our protests? The policies of our government - whether the subject be war, social spending, health care, bank bailouts - run counter to the expressed wishes of the populace. Yet we can't get 2000 people to protest these noxious policies in a nation that has freedom of speech, let alone 2,000,000. Are we cowardly, apathetic, or what?

Burton - There have been mass protests - of millions - around immigrant rights in 2006. This past year, protests for marriage equality have taken place around the country, and there is a national march called for this fall. We know from history that the first few years of an economic crisis are met with uncertainty. We need "urgent patience" as a friend of mine likes to say.

We have not gotten beyond the generation & a half that was essentially 'bribed' into quiescence. We do not have an organized left because of that, but it's surprising how quickly we can adapt.

Juan Cole has explained well how the elections were clearly fraudulant. Ahmedinejad won 70% of the Kurdish vote in Kermanshah? Really? These media outlets you speak of, spent several days NOT covering the Iranian elections. Neocons like Daniel Pipes - and the head of the Israeli Mossad by the way - both openly rooted for Ahmedinijad because it clears an easier task for the war they dream about. 2-4 million people in the streets. We should be calling for a deepening of this movement - not openly cheering for the crackdown.

I have been wrapped up in the unfolding situation in Iran for the past several days. The mainstream media in this country has been pathetic on this just as it is with everything else. Half the outlets actually didn't report anything for the first three days. These are mass demonstrations of enormous significance!! But there are other views out there. It isn't just Juan Cole who has been coming to terms with the outcome of the election. Long time left wing academics and writers, some very familiar with the situation there, have come to similar conclusions in terms of the highly problematic nature of the vote and the rightful aims of many of the protesters. Juan Cole, Gary Sick, Laura Secor of the New Yorker... bloggers (who are PhD students) and so on... most of these analyses I have found to be very thoughtful and scientific in their arguments. Knee jerk is the furthest thing from it.

Furthermore, I actually think its arrogant and chauvinistic to paint the actions of millions of people as simply NED dupes.

Also, I don't think we should equate our opposition to the imperial ambitions of the US (and Israel) with being uncritical of the regimes the US is hostile to.

Dave, I do not believe Juan Cole is correct on this. What direct ties does he to what is happening on the ground in Iran and to whom? As far as I have seen his contacts are mainly other academics. Also, the neocons may have been rooting for Ahmedinejad, but that does not automatically mean that the reformists are on the correct side of the fence either. That is similar to claiming that because some Republicans were against the bailout of the banking industry, then the Democrats who voted for it must have been right! They each have their imperialist interests and that is most likely why some mainstream media is covering the protests heavily and some are not. We must be patient to sort it out and seek out the voices of the true grassroots. Thanks for hearing me out.

Not to be disrespectful, but the article lost me at the word "pawn."

I never said anything about this being a color revolution (we all know the imperialist connotations with that) nor do I support Mousavi. Its just clear that this is much bigger than him. There are many reasons to protest Ahmedinejad, and it certainly does look like there was fraud. I by no means have access to the inside view I would like to have, but I have read a good deal, looked at photos and video footage. There is a sea of millions of people, and I would be wary of claiming there is no grassroots or working class element to it. I do in fact think there needs to be an independent working class intervention, and short of one, its hard to see where this goes. We can't wish for a picture perfect scenario to unfold. My hope is that what is happening in Iran can be the beginning of an ongoing struggle that can revive the left and change society for the better.

Also, I feel the need to defend academics... certainly not all of them, just the left wing ones ;) Not all of them live in an ivory tower.

Uh - soccer hooligans are suprisingly middle-class (at least in England, according to "Among the Thugs" I guess NO American sports writer actually ever read that book) - the big shock is they're NOT the disaffected proletariat.

Same for the demonstrators in Iran - these are students and professionals. The rural and urban poor are Ahmadinejad's base. You think the poor and disenfranchised in rural Iran have "twitter?"

These protestors are the same middle/upper class Tehran elites that overthrew the Shah.

Not knowing this makes the whole column suspect.

btw, anyone who thinks that
a) Mousavi is a "reformer"
or
b) that the US is behind the protests in Iran . . .

Really needs to learn to read (try huffpost). It's amusing to hear some of the staunchest critics of American government believing in it's omnipotence as much as the GOP fools do. And Israeli "imperialist" ambitions????? I suppose Israel's existence is an affront to all good liberals? Try to be smarter than the idiots on the other side of the aisle guys.

D-Mo - I absolutely agree with the 2nd post. The idea that the idiot politicians in this country could move 2-4 million into the streets strains credulity.

As for Among the Thugs (which I've read, thank you) and the class character of what is happening in Iran: Buford and others speak a great deal about the unemployed that involve themselves in hooliganism. Also I have disagreements with how Buford defines "working class." It's not unionists - a stereotype of working class" but it aint yuppies either. It's a lot of people with the kind of dead-end jobs that push their desire for street violence.

As for all those protesters in Iran. We know that they come from a wide swath of social classes, ethnicities, and backgrounds. No one should pretend though that they have an exact read of who exactly is out there in the streets. The expulsion of journalists and the unreliability of twitter/citizen journalism makes that so. We should lower the temperature on this side of the ocean and see what happens. But we should agree that something significant is taking place in Iran that far transcends easy definitions of "coups" or pawns or US interests, or "reform" as embodies by the free-marketeer Moussevi.

Get off the anti-semetic, loony lefty websites. Read the twitters that Iranians are sending, and try to remember that Israel is not evil, even if the GOP tends to push what it perceives as Israeli interest. A peaceful, two-state solution isn't going to come from demonizing Israel any more than right wing morons will get peace and safety from demonizing the Palestinians. Try to grow up and realize that good guys and bad guys are in bad westerns. In the middle east, it's a bit more complicated (well, actually a LOT more complicated than you'll believe if you swallow that garbage whole).

antisemitic? The link I included was for a group organized by JEWISH PEOPLE inside and outside of Israel, people I have met who have lived through much of it firsthand, not just something I have read on a website or going on twitter. Christian Peacemakers Team who have spent years working to support and make bridges between Israel and Palestine is another point of reference. The charge of antisemitism is nothing but propoganda started by American and Jewish zionist elites with corporate and political interests, not religious or humane, and picked up by some in the US media. Israel may or may not be evil in an of itself, but most of the people running it are rightwing Jewish fundamentalists that are in NO WAY representing the interests and rights of the people within. They screw over their own people left and right (including cutting benefits to poor women and children - the same thing the "reformers" are proposing to do in Iran), not even mentioning the treatment of Palestinians. There is not so much gray as you may want there to be. But on the matter of Iran where changes are happening minute by minute as we speak, it is you and those who are commenting here who are making fast judgements who are oversimplifying things my friend. ALL I was appealing to you all to do is to look at history when you are examining this "new" revolution.

antisemitic? The link I included was for a group organized by JEWISH PEOPLE inside and outside of Israel, people I have met who have lived through much of it firsthand, not just something I have read on a website or going on twitter. Christian Peacemakers Team who have spent years working to support and make bridges between Israel and Palestine is another point of reference. The charge of antisemitism is nothing but propoganda started by American and Jewish zionist elites with corporate and political interests, not religious or humane, and picked up by some in the US media. Israel may or may not be evil in an of itself, but most of the people running it are rightwing Jewish fundamentalists that are in NO WAY representing the interests and rights of the people within. They screw over their own people left and right (including cutting benefits to poor women and children - the same thing the "reformers" are proposing to do in Iran), not even mentioning the treatment of Palestinians. There is not so much gray as you may want there to be. But on the matter of Iran where changes are happening minute by minute as we speak, it is you and those who are commenting here who are making fast judgements who are oversimplifying things my friend. ALL I was appealing to you all to do is to look at history when you are examining this "new" revolution and search for more voices than the middleclass academics who may or may not understand all the political dynamics as well as their working class counterparts.

Dave,

I completely agree, the comparison is ridiculous. As a side note, it would be interesting to see if Iranian citizens (and women in particular) feel any relationship between the events of this past week and the "soccer revolution," which occurred back in 1997. Following the Iranian national team's win over Australia in World Cup qualification, a celebration was thrown in Azadi Stadium. Women were not allowed to attend sporting events (they still aren't), but women broke through police barriers and attended anyway. Ahmadinejad's comparison is off base, but there is definitely a soccer-politics relationship to be explored here. Did the success of the Soccer Revolution in some ways inspire the protests of today? And if so, what should Ahmadinejad really be saying about the sport?

Hope all is well,
Eben